|OT| DOTA 2 - Most Popular Mod in the world, Now AAA title [available for all]
- Thread starter faraany3k
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I've seen plenty of dota fanatics on the hon forums who were thoroughly disappointed by the beta. Its only the stupid fanboys who will blindly purchase the game without any reviews.. HoN won't die. The active fanbase will be there regardless of how dota turns out to be.
^ The graphics, the meta-game, the mechanics... And it wasn't just him. He has this old (SC1-era) friend who is a dota nut.. He wasn't impressed either.
According to them, they're sticking too much to its dota 1 roots. So much so that they're not improving the things that need a serious rework. DotA was, don't forget, built upon an RTS game.
Do you honestly like the graphics? I think the only reason you're in DotA is because you don't wanna spend time adapting to HoN. Trust me you'll love the game if you play it.
According to them, they're sticking too much to its dota 1 roots. So much so that they're not improving the things that need a serious rework. DotA was, don't forget, built upon an RTS game.
Do you honestly like the graphics? I think the only reason you're in DotA is because you don't wanna spend time adapting to HoN. Trust me you'll love the game if you play it.
In fact I do like the graphics, they aren't great but they are not bad either. Mechanics, well HoN wasn't all that great in beta either (I've played), it was clunky/slow/choppy (it has changed now though). If I compare HoN’s beta with DotA 2, than DotA 2 wins hands down.
They are right about the fact that they are sticking to DotA 1 roots which I think they need to change but I think that will be done after they have imported the DotA 1 hero roster.
All the DotA 1 pros of PK (DCMD knows em) have moved on to DotA from DotA & I haven’t seen em complaining about it.
Like I said few posts back, it’s a beta treat it as such. Only the final release will tell how well they have progressed. So far I think they need to pick up their pace because they are going a tad bit slow at the moment.
They are right about the fact that they are sticking to DotA 1 roots which I think they need to change but I think that will be done after they have imported the DotA 1 hero roster.
All the DotA 1 pros of PK (DCMD knows em) have moved on to DotA from DotA & I haven’t seen em complaining about it.
Like I said few posts back, it’s a beta treat it as such. Only the final release will tell how well they have progressed. So far I think they need to pick up their pace because they are going a tad bit slow at the moment.
HON is much faster paced then DOTA, but graphically DOTA 2 is much better. Though DOTA 2 interface needs little improvement.
Since VALVE and BLIZZARD are such great friends, I hope Blizzard help them with there interface.
I like HON and love to play it from time to time but its hero design is plain stupid. In DOTA they have ZUES with all his lightning attacks and stuff and that makes sense. But in HON they have thunder-bringer that is a fucking GORILLA with 'lightning abilities'. I mean WTF.
Since VALVE and BLIZZARD are such great friends, I hope Blizzard help them with there interface.
I like HON and love to play it from time to time but its hero design is plain stupid. In DOTA they have ZUES with all his lightning attacks and stuff and that makes sense. But in HON they have thunder-bringer that is a fucking GORILLA with 'lightning abilities'. I mean WTF.
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Dota2 is a newb fest right now. I played 3 games, ended each with 650+ gpm, and gave up. Screenshots like strikerx's are proof of this, one look at the stats will tell you its an extremely low level game. A razor with 77 CS in a 32 minute game? Come the fuck on, with an attack animation as easy as his, you should target that in 10 minutes.
I do know there are some very, very good players in the beta as well, but the amount of newbs simply drown them out.
Faraany3k, is your dota2 handle also faraany3k? You have only 16 games played on that, with absolutely terrible stats (kill:death ratio of 0.1; average kills per game 0.8; average creep kills per game 29; average creep denies per game 0.8 etc). I certainly don't mean to bash you on your stats, as being bad at a game isn't an issue, but I would like to point out that, and I hope you understand the concept and validity of my point, a player as bad as yourself simply cannot judge the quality, skill requirement, or balance of HoN. Granted the balance of HoN isnt perfect, but neither is that of dota or dota2 (or even LoL). These games have far too many variables and far too frequent additions to be balanced perfectly. Imbalance is the perpetual cry of the newb.
I remember when hon went f2p, around 12-16 pakistani dota players from PG tried it out. I added all of them to my buddy list (you were one of them). They all sucked balls, found the game too hard, and went back to dota where they could auto attack their way to victory. One of them played around 50 games and messaged me one day, wondering when, if ever, he'd get better at the game.
Anyway, no offence. If you indeed play from time to time, look for us in the channel paki.
---------- Post added at 02:48 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:44 AM ----------
Just to clarify, I am by no means suggesting dota/dota2 are easier games than HoN (I personally feel the inherent difficulty level of these games is on par with each other). However, I have run into far too many people who try HoN, get repeatedly gang raped up the ass, quit, and then comment on HoN as if they were progamers.
I'd also like to point out that the average pakistani garena dota player is absolute trash.
I do know there are some very, very good players in the beta as well, but the amount of newbs simply drown them out.
Faraany3k, is your dota2 handle also faraany3k? You have only 16 games played on that, with absolutely terrible stats (kill:death ratio of 0.1; average kills per game 0.8; average creep kills per game 29; average creep denies per game 0.8 etc). I certainly don't mean to bash you on your stats, as being bad at a game isn't an issue, but I would like to point out that, and I hope you understand the concept and validity of my point, a player as bad as yourself simply cannot judge the quality, skill requirement, or balance of HoN. Granted the balance of HoN isnt perfect, but neither is that of dota or dota2 (or even LoL). These games have far too many variables and far too frequent additions to be balanced perfectly. Imbalance is the perpetual cry of the newb.
I remember when hon went f2p, around 12-16 pakistani dota players from PG tried it out. I added all of them to my buddy list (you were one of them). They all sucked balls, found the game too hard, and went back to dota where they could auto attack their way to victory. One of them played around 50 games and messaged me one day, wondering when, if ever, he'd get better at the game.
Anyway, no offence. If you indeed play from time to time, look for us in the channel paki.
---------- Post added at 02:48 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:44 AM ----------
Just to clarify, I am by no means suggesting dota/dota2 are easier games than HoN (I personally feel the inherent difficulty level of these games is on par with each other). However, I have run into far too many people who try HoN, get repeatedly gang raped up the ass, quit, and then comment on HoN as if they were progamers.
I'd also like to point out that the average pakistani garena dota player is absolute trash.
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True that lol there is one time in every game that one of my friend taunts " kis kis bc ko invite di hui hai "
No wayyyyy!True
Bdw... dodo, you aren't BATTLEHUNGER or one of those are you? What's your in-game name? We see some pakis in the channel whose head is stuck somewhere up their ass lol Clan-mates messaged them but no one ever answers.
Why don't you upload your screenshot of 77 creeps with razor in 10 mins, i'd really like to see that.
Haha don't dare him he's a farm robot :tv: Last hitting comes naturally to him
70+ cs in 10 minutes isn't what you always get, but with a hero like razor going mid, it is what you should TARGET. I have achieved this goal with the razor counterpart in hon several times. Go mid with razor, win lane, control runes, and if you have decent last hitting, 70+ cs is achievable. I know for a fact good players in both hon and dota1, and I'm sure in dota2 as well, get this sort of cs on a somewhat regular basis.
I mean 50+ cs in 10 minutes is what every mid hero targets, and razor is one of the best in terms of last hitting, so yeah.
Furthermore the main point I was arguing that a razor that ends up with 77cs in a 30+ minute game simply cannot be good, unless he was vs some progamers and got stomped. Can you really argue this?
Matchmaking in d2 needs to be improved. Fucking Russians are annoying if you say something to em than they intentionally start feeding, some idiots start buying couriers only to send em into the opponents base.
@dodo
What's your steam id?
Sent from my Nexus One using Tapatalk
if you say something to em than they intentionally start feeding, some idiots start buying couriers only to send em into the opponents base.@dodo
What's your steam id?
Sent from my Nexus One using Tapatalk
Razor is far from one of the "best last hitting" heroes in the game, he has extremely low base damage and agi gain..this is the exact reason why Razor NEVER goes mid in a serious game. I can't comment on Hon but a 70+ CS is far from commonplace in dota, its only feasible with a tri carry free farming or an INCREDIBLE last hitter vs a complete novice. A total of 80 creeps spawn in one lane in the first 10 minutes, getting 77 of them is almost impossible. Take one rune and you miss 3-5 creeps.
Rice farming is just a skill not THE skill to judge a player by. Look at Eps.shapaang in the same game a pro player ( well not pro exactly still amateur but one of the top player in the Pakistan tournmanet circuit) who was probably mid and has almost no farm because maybe it works in hon but dota is a little more dynamic than that. Farming till death does not ensure victory.
Razor might not be the best last hitting hero in dota2 (I don't know, since I don't know all dota2 heroes), but he's certainly very easy to last hit with, won't you agree? One of my three dota2 games was played with razor, and I achieved 65CS in the first 10 minutes in a side lane.
Also, I'm surprised you mention eps.shapaang as an example to support the low CS is ok argument, because he's playing pudge, a hero that can be played as a roamer past level 6. Low cs on this hero is fairly common in both dota and hon, isn't it? Razor, on the other hand, isn't and shouldn't be played like this. I'm sorry, but no decent palyer will ever agree that 70 cs on a razor in 30+ minutes is acceptable. You can get way more than this despite being active in ganks/team fights (carry a tp at all times, duh).
Also, I'm surprised you mention eps.shapaang as an example to support the low CS is ok argument, because he's playing pudge, a hero that can be played as a roamer past level 6. Low cs on this hero is fairly common in both dota and hon, isn't it? Razor, on the other hand, isn't and shouldn't be played like this. I'm sorry, but no decent palyer will ever agree that 70 cs on a razor in 30+ minutes is acceptable. You can get way more than this despite being active in ganks/team fights (carry a tp at all times, duh).
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Umm you HONites count denies as CS ?
Depends on his lane enemy...for example a SF of equal quality in mid solo would completely eat him up with his necromastery bonus dmg, so would qb carrying melee's like bloodseeker, or heroes with high base damage eg lion.
Actually when razor is picked in comp..he's played as a tanky anti carry who DEFERS the farm to his HARD carries like spectre etc...A CS of around 100 is more than enough for his job which is to get a vanguard/pipe and steal the enemies carry's damage.
I've uploaded 3 screenshots of mine (only had 3 reps of myself) beating 70cs/10 mins with nevermore and razor respectively.
The tanky razor build also exists in HoN, but so does the dps build, and so does the tank+dps hybrid. If you've played dota for a long time, and are a decent player, you will know that most heroes can be played in multiple ways, based on whats happening in the game, the team and enemy compositions of heroes and items, the speed of your farm, etc.
I don't have issues with razor being built as a tank, but sorry, 77 cs in 32 minutes is simply unacceptable for this hero. Furthermore if you look over the game you'll notice razor isnt the only one with bad farm, they all have it, although of course pudge and support heroes (like strikerx) can be forgiven. The point being that it cant be a high level game.
I watched some razors in the 1.6mil$$ tournament and they always had respectable farm. (or maybe it was spectating games, I dont quite remember)
In any case, my only real two arguments were these:
1) A razor with 77cs in 32 minutes is bad farm, no matter what build you're going, and he or she should work to improve his or her farming
2) Extremely bad players are incapable of making cogent arguments about balance
---------- Post added at 05:26 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:23 AM ----------
Oh yeah, to clarify your question, this is how us honties count creeps:
Creep stats (CS) = Creep kills (CK) + Creep denies (CD)
So yes, CS includes denies.
The tanky razor build also exists in HoN, but so does the dps build, and so does the tank+dps hybrid. If you've played dota for a long time, and are a decent player, you will know that most heroes can be played in multiple ways, based on whats happening in the game, the team and enemy compositions of heroes and items, the speed of your farm, etc.
I don't have issues with razor being built as a tank, but sorry, 77 cs in 32 minutes is simply unacceptable for this hero. Furthermore if you look over the game you'll notice razor isnt the only one with bad farm, they all have it, although of course pudge and support heroes (like strikerx) can be forgiven. The point being that it cant be a high level game.
I watched some razors in the 1.6mil$$ tournament and they always had respectable farm. (or maybe it was spectating games, I dont quite remember)
In any case, my only real two arguments were these:
1) A razor with 77cs in 32 minutes is bad farm, no matter what build you're going, and he or she should work to improve his or her farming
2) Extremely bad players are incapable of making cogent arguments about balance
---------- Post added at 05:26 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:23 AM ----------
Oh yeah, to clarify your question, this is how us honties count creeps:
Creep stats (CS) = Creep kills (CK) + Creep denies (CD)
So yes, CS includes denies.
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Necrokiller:
The only valid thing from his pov he said in the video is AC dead since Black Flag. According to woke police that game was woke too. Welsh man in West Indies. So atleast he's consistent I guess lol -
Necrokiller:
It's based on an actual real life person so I don't think the woke police have a valid case here.
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XPremiuM:
Meanwhile Ghost of Tsushima PC version is out now. Looks 100 times better than ASS Creed already. -
XPremiuM:
Did y'all see the new Assassin's Creed trailer? They finally made a AC set in Japan & then they put a negro as the male protagonist. Ubisoft is taking cues from Disney, and it isn't gonna end well for them, just like Disney. Go woke, go broke!
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Necrokiller:
Phil should be held responsible for this shitfest too, just like Sarah, but it's highly likely that these decisions are coming from Satya. And this isn't even the end of it. More closures are coming.
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SolitarySoldier:
if we are moving towards more and more popular trash across platforms that make billions for companies, I'm happy with all the barriers and exclusivity because at least that brings some pressure to create good stuff. -
SolitarySoldier:
Phil keeps talking about breaking barriers to gaming, making it accessible on all platforms yada yada, while killing competition and creativity at the same time. the fact that i actually believed him for a second lol
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SolitarySoldier:
"These changes are not a reflection of the creativity and skill of the talented individuals at these teams or the risks they took to try new things" ... seems to me that's exactly what it is
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XPremiuM:
Microsoft deserves all the hate they can get. Seriously i can't explain how much i want to curse them out.
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XPremiuM:
They could've sold the studios instead of closing them, but the nazi bastards just didn't want competition down the road.
