MULTI Need Suggestions

[CerebralTiger]

lol @ largely.
Contrast needed for "impactful HDR" is inadequate on LCDs, thats why FALD exists, which introduces issues of its own.

It's not at all inadequate. As long as there are a decent number of dimming zones, FALD produces great results. First-gen Mini LED backlighting in Samsung QLED TVs is producing near OLED black uniformity already, and the eventual transition to Micro LED will take things one step further.

"Game changing" OLEDs are on borrowed time, just like Plasmas. The drawbacks are not at all worth the benefits.

I mean, Vincent, Digital Foundry and Rtings ALL seem to disagree with you here. As the best HDR gaming TVs they recommend happen to be OLEDs

"HDR gaming" gives precedence to other factors like input lag and response time, which matter more for gaming. These reviews don't, however, factor 30fps gaming, which is terrible on 120Hz OLED TVs.

Dude made a video for people who are saying OLED's don't need to get any brighter than they are today. Dude also says the "holy grail" is 4,000 nits. Does your X90H do that? Hell no. Dude is probably going to keep dropping that "fact" until TVs reach that value

I mean, if he's showing people that OLEDs do need to be brighter, and is using LCDs to support his claim, that says it all really lol. He's very clear about it:

"Peak brightness on current consumer OLEDs is not enough to accurately reproduce the true creative intent of HDR content, not only in terms of brightness but also in terms of detail."

At peak brightness on OLEDs, much of the highlights are lost. With dynamic tone-mapping (HGIG), highlights are preserved but the overall brightness is lowered. The Sony XH90 only clips minor highlights (it doesn't support HGIG) while retaining peak brightness. Samsung TVs are even better, as they do support HGIG and retain peak brightness.

Besides stating the "holy grail", he also mentioned that "the majority of content is graded to 1000 nits". Does my X90H do that? It's close enough. Do Samsung TVs do this? They surpass it considerably. The mini LED QLED TV I linked above reaches almost 2000 nits. LOLED

You didn't even understand the point of the "dude's" video. "Dude" ko decade se follow kar rahe ho par seekha kuch bhi nahi

Think again, who did and who didn't

 

[Necrokiller]

It's not at all inadequate. As long as there are a decent number of dimming zones, FALD produces great results. First-gen Mini LED backlighting in Samsung QLED TVs is producing near OLED blacks already, and the eventual transition to Micro LED will take things one step further.

"decent number"
"great results"
"near OLED black"

Jesus, look at all those semantic gymnastics when trying to justify that you purchased an inferior technology

Rtings gives Contrast level significantly higher importance when judging HDR content than HDR peak brightness. Whether it is about HDR movies or gaming. Input lag takes precedence in gaming, but Contrast levels remains of higher importance for HDR across the board compared to brightness. This is the reason why Vincent also recommends an OLED over these "near OLED but actually just LOLED TVs"

"Game changing" OLEDs are on borrowed time, just like Plasmas. The drawbacks are not at all worth the benefits.

Is this why Sony is also borrowing OLED panels from LG?

 

[CerebralTiger]

Jesus, look at all those semantic gymnastics when trying to justify that you purchased an inferior technology

I used these terms to explain that, while factors like contrast and black levels are indeed superior on OLEDs, the difference isn't startling. The difference in HDR, on the other hand, is. As Vince puts it, my TV more accurately reproduces the true creative intent of HDR content, not only in terms of brightness but also in terms of detail. That, coupled with the fact that HDR is considered a bigger game changer than 4k by some here, makes it superior technology

Rtings gives Contrast level significantly higher importance when judging HDR content than HDR peak brightness. Whether it is about HDR movies or gaming. Input lag takes precedence in gaming, but Contrast levels remains of higher importance for HDR across the board compared to brightness. This is the reason why Vincent also recommends an OLED over these "near OLED but actually just LOLED TVs"

Samsung mini-LED QLED TVs are very close now. Although I don't agree with RTINGS' subjective scoring methodology (I only go there for factual data), even they scored the Samsung QN90A and LG C1 equally wrt HDR movies, despite the higher weight assigned to contrast. It only falls a bit short in HDR gaming due to certain game mode related factors. Imagine how much better the Samsung TV must be in other areas. Yikes!

Is this why Sony is also borrowing OLED panels from LG?

It's why the market leading, Samsung, is striving to innovate with far more practical tech with far better HDR

 

[Necrokiller]

I used these terms to explain that, while factors like contrast and black levels are superior on OLEDs, the difference isn't startling.

If the HDR brightness difference over OLED is "startling" on X90H, why didn't Vincent recommend it over LG OLED? Not fair to the Dude to keep bringing up his words and not even follow his advice

I suppose if the "true creative intent of HDR" was to have poorer contrast levels, color saturation and blooming, then Sony X90H is a great pick! (yikesss)

Samsung mini-LED QLED TVs are very close now.

One could say they are......near OLED levels? (since thats the benchmark )

Good luck to LCDs in trying to overcome these inherent panel flaws

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1397528433954066432

Meanwhile, Guru Ledbetter is also using the LG OLED "day in, day out".

Sony X90H cries in a corner

 

[CerebralTiger]

If the HDR brightness difference over OLED is "startling" on X90H, why didn't Vincent recommend it over LG OLED?

His overall recommendation from last year went to the LG CX, but that's including other factors. He may not consider HDR to be as big of a game changer as a certain PG member here

Also, the Samsung QN90 and LG C1 are both 2021 TVs, so we'll have to see which one gets the nod this year.

I suppose if the "true creative intent of HDR" was to have poorer contrast levels, color saturation and blooming, then Sony X90H is a great pick! (yikesss)

Blooming is there on LCDs and contrast ratio isn't as high as OLEDs either, but guess what? Neither of these factors come in the way of delivering the true creative intent of the HDR source content. Neither a poor contrast ratio nor blooming result in loss of highlights. It's all about getting the picture as bright as possible without losing detail, and the Samsung QN90A blows away every other TV in this regard

But then, the LG C1...

Deikho RTINGS bhi wohi baat kar raha hai

Color mapping is off too, yikes!

 

[Necrokiller]

He may not consider HDR to be as big of a game changer as a certain PG member here

So thats why you didn't listen to his advice. Got it.

Blooming is there on LCDs and contrast ratio isn't as high as OLEDs either, but guess what? Neither of these factors came in the way of delivering the true creative intent of the HDR source content.

LMAO ofcourse they do, hence the higher weightage towards the final score

Also, the Samsung QN90 and LG C1 are both 2021 TVs, so we'll have to see which one gets the nod this year.

LG C1 is rated 9.0 for HDR gaming
Samsung QN90 is rated 8.8 for HDR gaming

But then, the LG C1...

And yet...

The LG C1 OLED is the best TV for Xbox One X or PS4 for HDR gaming. It delivers stunning picture quality thanks to its OLED panel that can individually turn off pixels, resulting in a near-infinite contrast ratio and perfect black uniformity. It doesn't have any issues supporting HDR games from either the PS5 and Xbox Series X, and it displays a very wide color gamut.

Game changer

True intent lulz

 

[CerebralTiger]

LMAO ofcourse they do, hence the higher weightage towards the final score

There's no loss of highlights with some blooming or a relatively lower contrast ratio. The picture would look a little washed out in darker scenes, yes, but specular highlights / fine detail would be retained. In brighter scenes, it would be on another level, though

Game changer

A verdict involving several factors, not just HDR

 

[Necrokiller]

An verdict involving several factors, not just HDR

OLEDs are ranked the best even in HDR specific content, thanks to the perfect contrast ratios and no FALD issues. No matter the brand, OLED is the way to go

A90J also happens to be using an LG panel

 

[CerebralTiger]

I can compromise in other areas, but I need my Necrokiller + creative intent certified full highlight + bright af game changing HDR

OLEDs are ranked the best even in HDR specific content, thanks to the perfect contrast ratios and no FALD issues. No matter the brand, OLED is the way to go

Reminds me of plasmas ruling TV rankings...until they ranked out one day

 

[Necrokiller]

True creative intent can't be fulfilled when the display lacks fundamental functionality of displaying proper black levels

No amount of brightness can overcome it, whether in SDR or HDR.

Sony X90H =

 

[CerebralTiger]

Creative intent = intended color depth (more here) and the preservation of specular highlights / fine detail.

This detail is lost on an OLED at its peak brightness (which is already below what an LCD is capable of), therefore, the brightness has to be dropped to retain detail at the expense of color vibrancy. You can't have both on an OLED, so choose your poison

Try this test with a PS5 on an OLED TV (I did, on a CX lol). The symbol disappears much earlier than it does on an LCD and you end up with very low brightness, lessening color vibrancy aka impact of HDR. Enabling HGIG (dynamic tone-mapping) does the same

True creative intent can't be fulfilled when the display lacks fundamental functionality of displaying proper black levels

You picked out contrast and black uniformity score comparisons, but the site labels both as "excellent" on the X90H and HDR brightness as a drawback on the CX

 

[Necrokiller]

You picked out contrast and black uniformity score comparisons, but the site labels both as "excellent" on the X90H and HDR brightness as a drawback on the CX

Excellent....for a VA panel. Compared to OLED? Refer to the scores please

But even for VA, Hisense model has better contrast ratio compared to X90H. Man, going with Sony was just a poor choice on your part

Anyway, its clear that the real issue here is you just being frustrated that every tech reviewer ended up agreeing with me. Not sure why else you'd keep bumping the thread

 

[CerebralTiger]

Anyway, its clear that the real issue here is you just being frustrated that every tech reviewer ended up agreeing with me.

Both Vince and RTINGS agree that the CX/C1's brightness is not sufficient for game changing HDR. They'd be agreeing with you if they thought otherwise

CX:

C1:

 

[Necrokiller]

Both Vince and RTINGS agree that the CX's brightness is not sufficient for game changing HDR. They'd be agreeing with you if they thought otherwise

Think the only person disagreeing with me, is you.

Vincent recommends LG CX for gaming as well. Twice.

"If you've watched this video without any bias or preconceptions, hopefully you agree with us that all things considered the LG CX OLED is the best TV for PS5 gaming"

Yes Vincent, one can only hope at this point. But alas, CerebralTiger will always be biased towards Sony

So lets recap:

Rtings --> LG CX
Digital Foundry --> LG CX
HDTV Test --> LG CX
.
.
.
.
CerebralTiger --> Sony X90H

Sounds like a pretty definitive "game changer" as I've always said

"If you've watched this video without any bias or preconceptions, hopefully you agree with us that all things considered the LG CX OLED is the best TV for PS5 gaming"

Poor Vince. He tried but even his decade old followers don't take him seriously

 

[CerebralTiger]

"all things considered"...right

 

[Necrokiller]

"all things considered"...right

Yep, and Sony X90H isn't even up for consideration

 

[CerebralTiger]

lmao never claimed my TV is an overall best. I made a qualified assessment based on burn-in (which both Vince and RTINGS agree is an issue), 30fps content, and the one game changing factor

 

[Necrokiller]

Well that "qualified assessment" doesn't seem to be going well since you're consistently bumping the thread trying to convince yourself that you made the right call. And selectively using the expert's opinion to feel better about the purchase when they didn't even recommend it as the second or third best TV to get for HDR gaming, let alone the overall best.

Oh well, hopefully Sony updates both your TV and PS5 this fall to support old game changing features like VRR so atleast the TV is somewhat more useful than what you paid for it

 

[Radical]

Guys, can we start a new discussion about which is the best gaming headphones ?

Specifically for PS5's 3D tempest audio. Presently, I have the Astros but just curious about others.

 

[Radical]

Sony's XM4, Steel Series arctis 7, Hyper X ka bhi hay aik, I forgot the exact name.

I am leaning towards Sony, ofcourse!